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McIntyre of Ireland - Origins

McIntyre of Ireland - Origins

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Posted Mon 25 Nov 2019 11:09 AM
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Glad to hear that you are both on the site and hopefully more information starts to add together.

Please keep us up to date with any progress! ☘️
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Posted Sun 20 Dec 2020 2:37 PM
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Well, further to my original post, a lot has happened. Before getting involved with getting a detailed Y-DNA STR test done, I was following leads found online.
From a McIntyre Forum:
Anthony Barrett
The McIntyre name can be found in Scotland, but its origin according to DNA is from the north-west coast of the Emerald Island. The McIntyre story [dominated by DNA tribal marker R1b-L513, Subgroup A1] can trace their origins to the Finn Valley in Donegal, Ireland from 50 BCE. Perhaps the journey begins with the Clanna Dedad; Deda, son of Sen or Deda Mac Sin. The McIntyre surname origin is from a Northern UÍ NÉILL [R1b-L513] tribe. The Cenél Eoghan and the tribes of Donegal conquered much of Ulster (Derry and Tyrone). Cenél Eoghan will expand across Northern Ireland with their cousins Cenél Conaill and the Northern Uí Néill between 500-800 BCE. The clans of Finn Valley have the same DNA as people from Gwynedd in Brittany. But how could this be? Recent discoveries from DNA testing are unlocking the migration patterns of Celtic tribes as late as 800 CE to 1200 CE. The McIntyre story begins in pre-history Ireland then moves to Scotland as they form part of the Dalriada. Descendants of their tribe will then travel to Brittany, France during the Dark Ages.

Since reading Anthony's comment, I went on the hunt to find the link to both the Northern Uí Néill and the Clanna Dedad, taking a trip through the history of the Dál Riata, and all kings being of Clanna Dedad. I bought the pdf version of Anthony Barrett's book, "The Tribe Within"... and find that he had contradicted himself with his comment on the McIntyre forum.
Anthony Barrett, author of “The Tribe Within” (written 2014 and updated 2018) had incorrectly assigned the DNA tribal marker of the ULAID (R1b-L513 [-S5668]) to the NorthernUí Néill. The DNA tribal marker for the Uí Néill (as I found out) is R1b-L21-Z2961-M222.  On page 6 of his book, he writes: The following surnames form a pattern of DNA Tribe R1b-L513 now identified as the Clan of Deda-Mac-Sin: … McCormick, McIntyre … 
And then I find the progenitor of THE Clan MacIntyre of Glenoe is a mac Néill! So, after getting a history lesson on the Clanna Dedad and Dál Riata through the ages, I turned to the Northern Uí Néill for answers. And I cut to the chase. I got a brother of mine to take a 111 STR Y-DNA test for me, and sure enough, the results came showing my McIntyre family descends from Niall Noígíallach (Niall of the Nine Hostages) himself, through the Cenél nEóghain. The DYS markers of my brother are a perfect match with those shown to be NialloNH.
However, despite Muirdach/Maurice mac Néill (mac Niall) being recoded as being a Prince within the Royal line of Cenél nEóghain and progenitor of Clan McIntyre, it would appear that my family may still not be of that Clan.
It is now known that the DNA Haplogroup for the Northern Uí Néill and the Connachta is R1b-L21-Z2961-M222; R1b being Celtic. However, the Haplogroup for the Clan McIntyre of Glenoe starts mostly with R1a-(Scandinavian), and even those with R1b-  do not match, so my family could not possibly be of that Clan.
Having said that, the Clan has approx. 600 years of history missing; that is to say, the first recorded Clan chief was Duncan MacIntyre who lived in the 17th Century.

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Posted Sun 20 Dec 2020 2:45 PM
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Forgot to add:

So, I have two questions:
1) Is it possible that mac Néill's line died, leaving the heir to be on mac Néill's maternal side (e.g. Granddaughter/Great niece generations down the line) to become Chief of the Clan?

2) My family is protestant, once shown to be covenanters, then Presbyterians (with some becoming Brethren later on); were there protestants in Ireland before Plantation took place?

The earliest record I have of my ancestors is a record of a Robert McIntyreborn c. 1808 in Broughshane, Co. Antrim and dying 26 Feb 1896 in Broughshane. He was married to Catherine McBride. So, for more than 200 years, my family has lived in and around that area and continues to do so, with relatives now operating the farm.

I think I have busted a family story of our roots being of Clan MacIntyre ofGlenoe before settling in Northern Ireland. It is now a matter of where we first settled and from which Tuath and Branch of Cenél Eóghain we descend.

I have found two maps of First Families of Old Ireland and both show ONEMcIntyre in Tyrone and one of the maps has the name marked as being a Chief. In fact, it is the ONLY piece of conclusive information regarding McIntyre being part of the Cenél nEóghain. 

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Posted Sun 20 Dec 2020 4:07 PM
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Hi Rhel,

Thanks for getting back to us with your updated information!

To answer your two questions, it is entirely possible that your line did indeed end on the maternal side. Secondly, there were protestants on the island of Ireland back in the early 16th Century. King Henry VIII became head of the Church of Ireland and he dissolved the Monastries of Ireland around 1539. 

Records that far back are extremely rare, you may get lucky, however, so keep looking you never know!
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Posted Tue 22 Dec 2020 2:42 AM
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Hi Martin;

Thank you for such a quick reply.
Yes, of course! Forgot about the big man and his reformation of the church. That answers that question.
And with mac Néill being the very first Clan chief, the Y-DNA had to have been of R1b, so my theory of the male line disappearing would have to be considered.

My Ancestry DNA, which is only good for Ethnicity really, showed, in the first set of results, 3% Norway and 3% French - The French would most definitely be of my mother's side, her father being a Simpson Highlander of Inverness, and Simpsons are the largest Sept of the Fraser Clan.
I had thought the Norway DNA would have been from Clan McIntyre, being part of the Western Isles, but as the Y-DNA shows, we are definitely Irish. And since reading up on the history of pre-Scotland, I learned that the Vikings had raided and settled up around Ross and Cromarty and Sutherland and Caithness, where my mother's family tree leads back to. So, it would seem the Norway DNA has been passed on from my mother's side also.
I have received an mtDNA kit to do, so will wait and see what surprises are in store on that side.

Back to the McIntyres; I have found that the McIntyre I saw on the map being in Co Tyrone would have been of the Clann Néill (Clan Neill), the progenitor being Néill Caille. The Clann was the most dominant of the Cenél nEóghain. I now need to investigate further and find which branch of that Clann the McIntyres came under.

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Posted Tue 22 Dec 2020 11:21 AM
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Hi Rhel! 

I'm happy to see Martin was able to provide you with more helpful information. :) It sounds like you've been able to discover a lot about your roots so far, and I hope the DNA will answer more questions. 

We're always here if you need any help with your research into Clann Néill (and anything else), and keep us posted on your findings and the DNA results! 

Warm wishes, 

Melin
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Posted Wed 23 Dec 2020 3:30 AM
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Thank you, Melin.
Yes, Martin has helped, and I am confident I'm on the right track now. All I need now is for my relative in Canada (I think I said the US previously - I have relatives there as well) to throw a spanner in the works with the information he has from an Aunt that researched our history many years ago.
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Posted Wed 23 Dec 2020 10:31 AM
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I hope you'll be able to get your hands on that information soon, Rhel! :) I also hope it'll provide you with the information you'll need to get further with your research. 

Again, we're always here if you need anything, and we wish you a lovely Christmas from the island of Ireland! 🎄
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Posted Wed 23 Dec 2020 10:47 PM
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And  a very MERRY CHRISTMAS AND A HAPPY NEW YEAR  to you and everyone here on the forum.
May 2021 be a far better year for everyone.

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